Keep these in mind when "Trying" to get rid of chicken strips

[JonKerr]

Here's a sequence of shots from last weekend on Highway 94 of a rider "Trying" too hard and getting too much lean angle without using proper body positioning. Probably showing off for the photographer as well which is the bad part of having photographers on these roads. Some of us use it to improve. Others tend to show off. You can see how crossed up he is from the start and he's going way too fast with way too much lean angle using horrible body positioning. Please keep this in mind when you're looking at those chicken strips and you want to "try" and get rid of them. Please educate yourself in proper riding skills and techniques before you try and push yourself to these limits.

 

[husker525]

The only thing missing in this photo is the helicopter landing to come take the rider away! Wow! That bike is history!! I hope the rider was ok. Great points, Jon!!

 

[gearhead]

OUCH! At least he had protective clothing on. I'm not a gear nazi, but if you're going to screw around like that, then protect yourself!

 

[MikeN02]

At least he was wearing his gear, except pants. His angle would have been done if he wasn't wearing those boots.

Right away I noticed he wasn't using good body positioning. You put pressure on the handlebars to turn but not when you're going in a corner that hot.

Correct me if I'm wrong but the "proper" way to take that corner is to basically have one cheek on the seat and kiss your mirror.

 

[JonKerr]

At least he was wearing his gear, except pants. His angle would have been done if he wasn't wearing those boots.

Right away I noticed he wasn't using good body positioning. You put pressure on the handlebars to turn but not when you're going in a corner that hot.

Correct me if I'm wrong but the "proper" way to take that corner is to basically have one cheek on the seat and kiss your mirror.

Having your weight to the inside, at least one cheek off, arms loose, upper body off to the inside over the mirror, inside knee out, outside knee hooked on the tank, etc... Everything to get the center of gravity low and to the inside in order to allow you to not have to lean the bike over so far. I guarantee a lot of riders make that turn all day long faster than he was going. But that's the difference between using the correct techniques and not.

 

[JonKerr]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the "proper" way to take that corner is to basically have one cheek on the seat and kiss your mirror.

Here's what I'm talking about.

This is me in that same turn. I'm using a hell of a lot less lean angle than the guy above because I've got my body in a better position. (Still not perfect, but better.)

This is Tom, one of the guys I've ridden with a number of times in our riding group. Again, same turn. I'd be willing to bet Tom is carrying quite a bit more corner speed than the guy above. But look how much less his bike is leaned over and how much more in control he is.

This is Chris, another friend who I ride with fairly often. Again, much less lean angle on the bike and much more in control.

Their center of gravity is much lower and to the inside of the bike, allowing them to not push the bike to it's limits yet still carry higher corner speed. Do these guys go too fast? Sometimes yes and I've told them that and they'll admit it. Usually when they're riding like these pictures and getting a knee down, they've already gone up and down the road scouting it to make sure there's no debris or anything unexpected in the road. Not that something can't happen between runs. But that's the risk they're willing to take since they're still not really pushing themselves beyond maybe 75-80% of what they'd be doing on the track.

What about for someone who's not riding as fast as they are? It'll allow you to carry the same speed you're comfortable going using less lean angle and giving you even more of a cushion for that "Oh $#it" moment when something unexpected can happen.

 

[Detrich]

ouch... that guy really ought to have been wearing leather pants with knee/ shin armor. hope he didn't get hurt too badly. it's amazing that the photographer just kept shooting and got the entire crash sequence too... so i guess the moral is to position your body to lean into the turn, not lean the bike to where it tips over...

 

[creggur]

What's really sad is if this guy would have simply moved his upper body down and to the inside of the turn it would have probably saved his bike. Having his body center-line beyond the bike's center-line to the outside of the curve caused the excessive lean angle (bad, bad, bad move).

I'd be willing to bet that the bike/tires would have pulled this move off - even with the horrible form - had it not been for additional slop added to the equation. I'm guessing he was running the bike in the midst of its powerband, which is fine if you know what you're doing, but takes away any margin for error with throttle input. Get crossed up like that in the middle of a bad line through a curve with the bike ready to lurch if you breathe on the throttle and down you go.

Fortunately for us, modern sport rides will allow some room for sloppy input (the bikes are way better than us) but cross too many lines and physics will bitch-slap you every time.

Hope the rider is ok!

 

[creggur]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the "proper" way to take that corner is to basically have one cheek on the seat and kiss your mirror.

You are correct, Mike. How I learned this was to first start taking curves with my butt square on the seat, but my upper body leaning to the inside - this gives you most of the advantages of 'hanging off' because you've moved the entire bike's center of gravity lower and to the inside (our head and shoulders are heavy and can affect CG considerably) requiring less lean angle to 'make' the curve.

I then started shifting my entire body more to the inside (one cheek off the bike) while keeping my upper body in the same relationship to my lower body - head and shoulders further inside than my butt.

Having said that - what is waaaaay more important than perfect body position is selecting the correct line and SMOOTH throttle control. I'd bet I could go through that curve faster than he was going sitting up bolt-straight because I'd take the proper line and use SMOOTH brake/throttle inputs to negotiate the curve SMOOTHLY. Not being arrogant, I'm far from perfect, it's really about relaxing and letting the bike do what it was engineered to do while not mucking it up for the motorcycle with unsettling throttle or brake inputs...

 

[dart1963]

bad form or not... all he had to do was come in a lot slower, even with the right form it's still possible to take a turn too fast. He could have just hit a pea sized gravel and done that, and yeah, if he'd had a left himself something (either by slowing down or getting a little better form) he could react to it.

He also had bad falling form... he realized way to late that it was done and looked like he was trying to hang on... you gotta push away from the bike and get on your back ASAP once you realize you've gone too far.

 

[Marthy]

You are correct, Mike. How I learned this was to first start taking curves with my butt square on the seat, but my upper body leaning to the inside - this gives you most of the advantages of 'hanging off' because you've moved the entire bike's center of gravity lower and to the inside (our head and shoulders are heavy and can affect CG considerably) requiring less lean angle to 'make' the curve.

I then started shifting my entire body more to the inside (one cheek off the bike) while keeping my upper body in the same relationship to my lower body - head and shoulders further inside than my butt.

Having said that - what is waaaaay more important than perfect body position is selecting the correct line and SMOOTH throttle control. I'd bet I could go through that curve faster than he was going sitting up bolt-straight because I'd take the proper line and use SMOOTH brake/throttle inputs to negotiate the curve SMOOTHLY. Not being arrogant, I'm far from perfect, it's really about relaxing and letting the bike do what it was engineered to do while not mucking it up for the motorcycle with unsettling throttle or brake inputs...

Did you find a curve in Florida? Let me know...

 

[Marthy]

bad form or not... all he had to do was come in a lot slower, even with the right form it's still possible to take a turn too fast. He could have just hit a pea sized gravel and done that, and yeah, if he'd had a left himself something (either by slowing down or getting a little better form) he could react to it.

He also had bad falling form... he realized way to late that it was done and looked like he was trying to hang on... you gotta push away from the bike and get on your back ASAP once you realize you've gone too far.

I agree with you here. Country road are not the safest place to push your machine. Especially on a bike. You can get away with a little bit more in a car, but still I alway leave a bit of room for an "oh shit moment". Before I bought my bike this summer I haven't drove in so many years. I was able to drive and grind foot pegs all day long. I like to get back to that level, but there's no where in Florida where I can sort of safely ride and lean the bike. It's all straight road here in Florida!

My best option: PBIR (Palm Beach International Raceway) About 15 min from here, newly all repave. They have track time for about anything that burn fuel. Primary a race car track, they have a drag strip (also one for mud drag), kart track, supermoto... I bet if 15 riding mower show up there, they will let you race them too!

One more thing. You brought a good point here. Knowing how to fall is just as important then knowing how to ride... everybody that drove or drive dirt bike know that. When you know you screw up, let go! Don't try to bring it back.

 

[creggur]

Did you find a curve in Florida? Let me know...

Nah, have to shoot up to Georgia for those.... Fortunately, I live close to the border.

 

[99vengeur]

It's amazing the photo sequence. I have seen so many crashes documented with photos, that it's easy to see where people go wrong.

Did anyone see thay the spokes of the front wheel just snapped off and stayed attached to the front axle, while the rest of the rim and tire stayed together? Took some force in just the right way to do that!

Stay within your limits and you'll make it home safe!

 

[JonKerr]

From what I heard the rider is just fine. Some bumps and bruises but nothing more.

Edit: Found this pic showing him off to the side and sitting up fine.

 

[jcbrown630]

Prolly puckered up Chopped the throttle and overloaded the front tire. If you ever find yourself too fast in a corner the LAST thing you want to do is close the throttle. RUINS your traction. Overloads the front and the weight distribution moves forward. What little rear tire traction is left is now being used to slow the bike and not for cornering. SR#1 avoid at all costs.

 

[JonKerr]

Prolly puckered up Chopped the throttle and overloaded the front tire. If you ever find yourself too fast in a corner the LAST thing you want to do is close the throttle. RUINS your traction. Overloads the front and the weight distribution moves forward. What little rear tire traction is left is now being used to slow the bike and not for cornering. SR#1 avoid at all costs.

Someone has read Keith Code.

 

[jcbrown630]

Someone has read Keith Code.

An invaluable resource. Actually I downloaded the video

 

[99vengeur]

An invaluable resource. Actually I downloaded the video

Books on tape FTMFW!!!

:rof:

 

[dart1963]

Prolly puckered up Chopped the throttle and overloaded the front tire. If you ever find yourself too fast in a corner the LAST thing you want to do is close the throttle. RUINS your traction. Overloads the front and the weight distribution moves forward. What little rear tire traction is left is now being used to slow the bike and not for cornering. SR#1 avoid at all costs.

haha, yeah, small adjustments, nothing major mid turn. All your major adjustment should be done before you hit the turn, your line (entrance, apex, exit), your speed, your body position.

I'm always happy to come out of a turn saying "I could have taken it faster" rather than "Can you pick up my bike for me"!