Bad Feeling

[Funkmaxtor]

Today I was out for a pretty spirited ride with a bunch of friends on sport bikes (mainly liter bikes). We were on a road that only one person sort of knew. After a series of fairly tight turns I felt like I was starting to push my ability limits, so I waved two of the guys that were right behind me around as I backed of the throttle. We enter the next turn and all was well till about half way through the turn it tightened up severely. The guy in front of me already had his knee down on the pavement and still didn't stay in our lane. Next I see the guys that sort of knew the road and he was laying under his bike against a guide rail with the back tire spinning about 2 inches from his head. He didn't realize that the turn tightened that hard and it spooked him. He hit the front brake in the turn and low sided. Luckily he was ok, just a few bruises despite only wearing jeans on the bottom. He did have a leather jacket that did its job well and gloves. Somehow he managed to keep his helmet from hitting anything. The bike was scratched a bit and the turn signals were both broke as well as most of the plastic fasteners.

So what did I learn from all this? When you know that you are at your ability limits slow down. If I didn't do that I know I would have joined him in the guide rail party!

 

[MikeN02]

I second that statement! I don't take turns or roads that I don't know fast at all. It scares the crap out of me because I don't know the road and what comes after it. Even if I see the turn before I make it I'm still careful, I would have to ride the road for a couple months before I can get more speed and curve into it.

That's why my friend calls me a Pus!# rider, but hey... at least I'm safe.

Especially with a liter bike? man that's real danger

 

[JonKerr]

Very good thing you knew your limits. One thing to remember, if you're not familiar with the road or the road conditions, best to just cruise until you're much more familiar with it and until you know the roads are clear.

But you're right, your limits are your limits, any you know them better than anyone else. If you're just not feeling it, not comfortable, or just get a feeling that things just aren't right, back off. Don't push it. You should never be riding more than 70% of your capabilities anyways so that when you do come to that decreasing radius turn that you're not expecting comes up, you have some cushion there to use when you have to.

 

[fz6rwolf]

Very good thing you knew your limits. One thing to remember, if you're not familiar with the road or the road conditions, best to just cruise until you're much more familiar with it and until you know the roads are clear.

But you're right, your limits are your limits, any you know them better than anyone else. If you're just not feeling it, not comfortable, or just get a feeling that things just aren't right, back off. Don't push it. You should never be riding more than 70% of your capabilities anyways so that when you do come to that decreasing radius turn that you're not expecting comes up, you have some cushion there to use when you have to.

+1, still got quite a bit chicken strips and probably always will.

 

[MikeN02]

+1, still got quite a bit chicken strips and probably always will.

I always have and more or likely always will. My friend looked at my bike and said I still have chicken stripes, even though I'm at the 2k Mi mark.

But every time my friend and I ride he always says don't do anything you're uncomfortable with. And also it's a general rule of thumb with us or anyone else we ride with is to not try and keep up with the people in the group who can't control themselves from time to time, they'll wait for you.

 

[JonKerr]

I'm an organizer for a local meetup group. We put on group rides, anything from 4 or 5 buddies out carving canyons, to 100 bike rides out to the desert. We also do free riding clinics (like one I just organized and held this last Saturday.) One of the first things we tell people is to ride within 70% of your limit. And DO NOT try to keep up with the guy in front of you. We wait at all road changes for the slower riders so we don't loose anyone. We have a group lead and usually a sweep in the back as well, all usually on Chatterboxes, so we can make sure everyone is safe. Not that we're always putting around or anything. We get after it. But only within our limits. For big rides we'll split up into groups based on speed and capability, trying to keep the fast guys with the fast guys and so on. We tell people all the time, we'd rather wait for you than wait for an ambulance.

Experienced riders will always give you crap about chicken strips. But most of the time, it's just that, giving a friend crap. 99% of them will do the same thing. They'll mess with you about not using up the tire, then when it comes time to be serious, they'll make sure you know to take it easy and only ride within your limits. The fact is, if you don't have any chicken strips left, especially with the stock bricks that come with this bike, you're probably pushing a bit too hard. My stock tires had pretty much no chicken strip left. I was scraping pegs left and right all over the place. I was beginning to experience some rear wheel slides and nearly highsided one time. Then I started reading some books (Kieth Code Twist of the Wrist and Twist of the Wrist II) and attended a few riding clinics and began using proper body position. This latest set of tires (Pirelli Diablo Rosso) still has a good 1/2" of chicken strip. (Partially but not entirely due to the extremely steep profile of the tire, but that's a whole other discussion) Yet because I'm using my body properly, I'm considerably faster through the twisties than I ever was. When you use proper body positioning, you don't have to lean the bike over as far. The more upright the bike is at the same speed, the more grip you have and the more stable you're going to be.

Here's a perfect example. See in the pic below how upright I am on the bike? That day, I was scrapping my pegs all over the place, doing about 35 through that turn that has a 25mph cautionary sign on it.

In this pic though, I'm much lower on the bike, hanging off a bit, hooking and anchoring myself with my outside leg, and doing about 55 through a similar turn.

I was far more comfortable in the second pic and far safer doing 20mph more because of the way I was riding. In the first one I was pushing the limits that day and damn near highsided that afternoon on Palomar.

 

[FZ1inNH]

Perfectly spelled out JonKerr! Well done! Had you not answered, mine would have been very much the same. :thumbup: I also organize many rides and employ the same tone, strategy and instructions to the group.

Thanks!

 

[JonKerr]

Thanks. I find I'm a bit anal about safety but you have to be. Especially if you're out with a group. When I put on my group rides I have a rider meeting before we take off where I lay down the rules and I'm adamant being safe out there. No passing on double yellows, no passing each other unless you're waved by or do it on a broken yellow in the other lane, etc... If I'm going to lead a group ride, it's going to be at my pace. If that's too slow for you, don't join and go ride on your own. If it's too fast, don't worry, hang back, ride comfortably, and we'll have a sweeper behind you to make sure everyone is safe.

 

[Funkmaxtor]

The group I was with also stresses the same things. Everyone is always told to ride how you feel comfortable and we will wait for you at the next intersection if necessary. The guy that went down was the one that was in the front and just didn't recognize his limits like the rest of us did. The more I think about the happier I am that I can recognize my own limit and stay well below that limit so I could avoid a situation like that. I reviewed the video (had my Go Pro on) and I watched the guy that I waved past miss the downed ride by only two feet. Closer that I would want to be. Thanks for all the input everyone is giving. I'm glad to see that everyone has such a safe routine during group rides.

 

[JonKerr]

I might as well through this out there as I've had a few messages over the last couple of months when I've mentioned the meetup group I'm part of. There's a nationwide website Meetup.com There are meetup groups on there for everything from scrap bookers to sportbikers and everything in between. Chances are, there's some kind of group near you who have organized themselves on this site. In 2-3 years, the San Diego Sportbike Meetup Group has grown to 800+ members. If you're looking to join some group rides, this might be a good place for you to look. I can't guarantee however that they're all as safety minded as the group I'm in. Hell, even within our group there are a number of guys who head out to roads like Palomar and Montezuma and treat them like they're a race track. Needless to say, those guys don't join rides that specify that they're going to be a safety minded ride. But check it out and get a feel for a group in your area.

 

[Funkmaxtor]

I will have to check that out. Thanks for the recommendation.

 

[Napoleon]

sheeeit

Trust me, we all feel you bro. Those that'd comment on this thread anyways. There's many bikers out there that for whatever reason don't really give a S)(it... Bout them, their bike, or you. Any rider who doesn't know their limits is a time bomb. Whether or not you want to be behind them going 120 when they find theirs is up to YOU. :Flash:

 

[streetmaster]

I always err on the side of caution. The thing is, even if it's a road you know well, the road surface can change from day to day, hour to hour. Debris can be blown across the road just on the exit of your favorite corner or some sort of spillage, diesel, water etc. You just never know.

 

[ksanbon]

Great thread! :thumbup:

My thoughts:
1. Expect the unexpected
2. There's always more to learn
3. Excess ego can kill